♪ neil: it is a good thing the president was visiting a cutting edge technology school in brooklyn today. i hope the hired a couple of the students there and took them back to fix his website fast. a congressman who says it is time for kathleen sebelius to pack up and go. corporate america might demand accountability, it does -- that does not mean washington does. judging from harry reads latest comments ever will. it turns out that he thinks we have a big tax problem in washington, but not that we are taxed too much but too little and he feels the same way. ben hamper shut up. tonight we. : ala. a year after san the things are

still far from bandy, and let's just say new york attorney general had to find out the hard way in a very embarrassing white. today we have russell brand railing about confidence and. and other brick, let it ready for the royal rumble. all that and whether you should buy into twitter and 140 characters or less. whether southwest is getting on with the baggage v band wagon good are bad. get ready because "cavuto" takes off now. ♪ >> the majority of people calling for me to resign are people who i would say i don't work for. neil: leaving aside the she works for all of us, wouldn't it be wiser for a woman who is more or less saying only the president can fire her.

so he won't. because as things stand now, the health care law barely standing in all, the website is a mess and democrats are calling for delays. no less than the new york times says the singular achievement of lower health care costs for the poor is not being achieved. clearly at is on the president. this is his baby, but it is more immediately on the secretary because her health and human services department was the one in charge of delivering this baby, and she's not. maybe because we're coming to find she just cannot. she is not up to the job because she simply is not equipped to do the job. maybe it is not her fault. she was a governor, never a doctor. she really was never big on medical stuff which is weird that she would be put in charge of a cabinet post that is kind of all medical stuff, especially now we're implementing a health care law would also require at least some familiarity with technology stuff. is a po on that as well. a question tonight, why do we

keep hiring the wrong kind of people for these crucial jobs? or even help of a clue as folks that we put in charge of these positions at least be familiar. republican congressman john flemming wants to know the same thing because he has included this much, sibila as is not up to the task. you're the secretary. you don't have the say in this, but that is the president's decision. easier to believe she is not going anywhere. >> well, she is saying that the 33 members of the house are now calling from -- for resignation, she does not work for a spirit ahead to tell her this. she is a public servant. my taxes pay her salary, and the american people, she works for all of us. she may take orders from the president of the united states, she works for us, and she is obviously saying through this she has the arrogance and hubris to say, i don't answer to you guys. and do what i want.

as long as president obama is going to protect my flank to my can do whatever i want, and i don't even have to answer your questions. il: what is disturbing is that she is right that the president hires and fires. sometimes under to -- arrest. a lot of the rest of this thing. he is keeping her now. what does that tell you, the person in charge going all over the country justify why she should still be in charge but is not in washington making this thing work. >> you're right. we don't see evidence that she's telling her sleeves up and trying to help and get this thing done. and to r that as secretary of hhs, not only is the governing over a massive federal department, but also a company, and a sense, a company that runs 16 the largest economy in the world under obamacare. and just like a large company, microsoft, wherever you want to name it, amazon, she should be

held accountable for the poor performance and remember that this rollout of the website, they should have seen it coming. she did not tell her bosshat this was going to happen even there she learned of this. remember, this was just the outer court, the facade of what is really a much worse system underneath. seven man happy to talk about all the problems with the actual law itself. neil: that is a separate show. in the meantime, thank you. the democratic congressman also blasting the health care website and the hearing by giving a shot out to dot com companies. listen to this. >> thousands of websites that carry far more traffic. i think that is really kind of a lame excuse. amazon and ebay do not crash the week before christmas and -- neil: and ice advertising bit. the chief technology officer, we are keeping a lot of things out

of it. what they are referring to is just being logistically up to speed. this was not. you guys try to make a point of it. certainly on the days that matter, as a valentine's much more the case. do you prepare for that? what do you seem to think was not the case with this law? >> absolutely. as you said, we are a big retailer. for valentine's day and mother's day we will take over two and a half million page views in a single hour, do over 35,000 orders in that now -- order. there is a lot of work that goes into that. neil: i am not too smart to my but obviously you guys a. you fill the orders. so what i want to know, how do you prepare for those days? what do you do ahead of time? whatever you do they did not do. i am not passing political disparity, but how do you avoid any problems?

>> absolutely. we do testing all the time. your performance testing is something that is kind of built into our system, built into our teenine process. we are testing in fremont. we are running full production to make sure we can handle the traffic of the valentine's day and mother's day. neil: how do you factor that in? you think you would get a million calls, 2 million, what do you do? >> we literally run that load every month against their site. and then we take all that data, make sure that the system is responding the way we expected to. you know, work on the things that are not working correctly. it is not something that just happens by accident. it is something that we believe we are experts in. it's something we have learned of the last 13 years and being with the company, and something that we take very seriously. a reliable solution for our customers. that is when we have to hit it.

neil: they say that i would -- the whole game, the end user matters. is it easy for them, easy to get on to make it on, get off, be done? that does not appear to be the case. you know enough. is it too late to redo this system? you're thinking they have to start from scratch, or can they pass those things together? >> as you said, is difficult to up work from the outside but such as the foundation. you cannot take a slow website and fix it rose. you really have to us for the foundation of the house and make sure that the way they you architect and designer in upfront is really set up to scale. so i cannot speak in their particular is and the things that they have built for the health care tab site --

healthcare.gov website. but i cannot say that it is an easy task. neil: you know dates. you remind me of my anniversary. so obviously. neil: thank you. very much. very good reason this. what does it take to fire someone in the administration? healthcare.gov -- kathleen sebelius has a track record for a very big mistakes. well, he just says that not to get rid of her, but they're is a pattern here. explain. >> when she was governor of kansas kathleen sebelius was always -- also attached to a group, several website launches and kansas' dollars costing lots of money. that is not a lot of money for anybody. the department of labor, supposed to be unemployment. screwed up from the foundation.

and believe, still fixing that are dealing with the aftermath. she came to washington in 2009. left this big mess of what size behind her. obviously no one looked into it. you know, when she was named by the head of hhs, is quite possible no one forgot about it. is she any good with website spirit of point of it -- neil: it should have been. if you need is she was going to be shepherded move would be a signature go of this case, the president had been planning, the details had to be worked out and the ball from of the fact of the matter was hhs was going to be the department to wrigley that. and you knew about a woman who might have been a fine governor, your comments notwithstanding, but she was not the person that i would think knee-jerk to be put into that position. >> not at all. in addition to her lack of medical experience which she mentioned before. she is an entirely political creature as the entire -- both

obama administration so far have been entirely political people. george bush went through three secretaries of the treasury, i believe in his first -- certainly at least two in his first term and then it changed again in the second term. that is with a good economy. that is what is a fairly mild recession compared to what we have seen in the last five years . also, no one seems to be held accountable. hillary clinton was not held accountableor benghazi, obviously. we don't see anybody stepping forward from the nsa. we have learned now, kathleen sebelius serves in the same way they do under the monarchy in the u.k., at the pleasure of the executive. neil: all that can be well and good, but could someone u.s. something attached to expertise for the agency they will take over. if you take every the interior department you should like the outdoors. that would be a start.

you will have some background. >> and now we would get this guy , j johnson, homeland security, his background is representing a guy who put our rat tail in an order of fries and tried to sue mcdonald's. -- neil: the right thing, there might be some benefit to that. thank you very much. but he's right. we have to rethink the way we choose. these are powerful government agencies overseen not only a lot of personnel but big government initiatives. when john kennedy was giving the space program up and running he for said to my know people who -- many people know about rockets. all right. that was then, not not out. not just taking off people here but all our friends. now it is reverberating, hurting our businesses, trying to do

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>> with your boss on the nsa? >> i don't like the idea of being watched, they're paying people with my money to watch me >> the sense that you may be watched, known parts of think it's horrible. >> what are your thoughts on the nsa? >> it's everywhere. >> the government being able to look at your phone records and the males. >> it does not bother me. i am not up to anything and should not be doing. if they want to look, there will not find anything to exciting. >> i think there is a little too much information gathering going on. >> i'm not unhappy. >> do you think that is going to cause some friction? >> it is already done that. it's very pretty to look at.

neil: he is right about that, and no doubt the only one upset. a lot of smart countries are saying, wait a minute. a possible $4 billion contract with boeing, you know, we don't trust you guys. former democratic congressman, this seems to be having some residual problems for us. what do you make of it? >> when you look at ted german chancellor, she grew up under the stasi in east germany. she knows about a surveillance society. he has a reasonable expectation that the united states will not tamper cell phone. and so i think that here is someone who comes from a country where privacy really mean something. there are a lot of laws and all of a sudden she finds out that her name pops out on this latest release of and permission. it is going to hurt our relations with germany and our relations with other countries who will suffer as a result of spying on their leaders, particularly when they're

supposed to be our allies. neil: i often "a possible lockout. but shocked that there's gambling going on here. this kind of thing has been going on while we are told. now there is this fellow raise that it is happening. i am saying am told has been going on. the country and the various leaders know what's going on. >> let's assume you are right. at the round up the usual suspects. neil: right. >> the truth of the matter is someone in the administration made a call to give a rolodex over to the nsa to have the private phone numbers of all of these world leaders come and there are implications for that. neil: who made that call, congressman? not only her office, phones, cell phones, that has got to be someone fairly high happen, doesn't this? >> it would have to be, and that is something that the media ought to be asking questions about.

you handed over a rolodex with hundreds of phone numbers, relating to a certain group of world leaders, including our allies, who handed that to the nsa? the nsa domestically has become a threat to our own civil liberties. internationally the nsa could actually be taking steps that are counterproductive to america's economy, financial data sharing plans are going to be set aside now between the united states and european community's. contracts, as you pointed out earlier, being set aside. we have to ask ourselves, is this so important that we are willing to risk our relationships with these other countries? neil: currently, the president had apparently talked to her the day before she got up and bit upset. and then lo and behold she discovers that it is still going on. so assuming the president is telling the truth or what he thought was the truth, is his

being out of the loop, would that be scary to you? >> it would be a great concern because of the level of surveillance that is occurring with four leaders, but there is another issue year, and i know we don't have a lot of time, but keep this in mind. we don't look at germany as being a threat. there is an economic issue, and we have got to start asking questions. is this being done to advantage serve -- certain corporate interests in the united states against other call will interests. neil: that is a very good point. >> we need to know. we need to find out. neil: that is a very good point. three seeing you again. a good weekend. all right. over the past five years we have spent more on welfare than the entire german or british economies. enough. enough to fill those countries with the poor that we did not want to make poor and those who

are not good enough food to make sure. more than ever before charlie wasted. ♪ this is the quicksilver cash back card from capital one. it's not the "juggle a bunch of rotating categories" card. it's not the "sign up for rewards each quarter" card. it's the no-games, no-messing-'round, no-earning-limit-having, do-i-look-like-i'm-joking, turbo-boosting, heavyweight-champion- of-the-world cash back card. this is the quicksilver cash back card from capital one. unlimited 1.5% cash back on every purchase, everywhere, every damn day. now, tell me, what's in your wallet? ...amelia... neil and buzz: for teaching us that you can't create the future... by clinging to the past. and with that: you're history. instead of looking behind... delta is looking beyond. 80 thousand of us investing billions...

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neil: it is a staggering sum. let's get that figure. how much we have spent over the last five years. on nothing. yet 46 million people still living in poverty. reports of the poor actually increasing in numbers. we are doing something wrong, or are we? you bet we are doing something wrong. the welfare state is taking it away. so you pick -- the more money we are pouring into this the more we make things worse.

>> absolutely. we get rid of the welfare law and everything seems to be turning a. exactly. it is the incentivizing, well-intentioned. i don't dispute the intentions, and it is trying to help and give a safety net, but it gets people of their self-worth, it gets people of pride. it gets them off of the track a beginning their rising career. it puts them into a holding pattern. it just puts them into the lack of discipline, lack of all the things that a part of the civil society. neil: some worry that the money we spend seems to indicate that we should be getting much better results than we are. so we have got to do something different. i don't know what it is, but it is certainly not all we have been doing. >> the reason we are seeing more people on welfare is because the economy is not doing well. people don't have jobs and obviously cannot pay for food.

the macro problem is that the economy needs to turn around and be more jobs. after member that everybody on welfare is not just sitting at home. a lot of people are working poor , people who have multiple jobs. there is caricature of the idea of people on welfare. neil: that might be so calm about a hundred million americans did some sort of food assistance, you're telling me one out of three americans warranted this kind of help. that is a depression-level this type help. that is us seem to jive. >> dennis certainly says that there is a major problem with our economy which is true. and in a country like ours you should not have a third of the people needing help with the assistance for food. i'm not saying it's a perfect system but think that there are people who really do need.

neil: it is not 100 million. what i think has happened and what worries me is that we all want to feed the poorest of the poor. my concern is this is out of control, out of control. >> and totally of control when she says that what we need more jobs. how would you propose we do that? by giving people who don't have jobs the money or creating jobs, getting into retraining programs. there are a lot of jobs out there that go unfilled. i will give you one. i am a director of an oil field services company had of houston, texas. they're starved for people with big salaries in east texas and west texas. we can and will become energy independent probably of a five or six years, but we don't have nearly enough people. now, from new york and you don't necessarily want to go to texas. i understand that love of people have always followed the job market. people of -- have migrated from

florida to new york. neil: i'm not doing that. your argument, again, that good intentions. it takes away that drive. people won't make a move from new york to florida. there will stay where they are. more independency. >> on welfare with children saying that they should be packing up their kids? don't really understand. >> i'm not arguing. neil: here not saying they should go work and an oil rig. listen to what i'm saying. specifically that there is dependence that it sets that makes it very hard for you to get off of it because it is there, it is expanded. at the margin it makes a difference between someone deciding whether to go to work were stopped entertaining and stay at home. in other words, it becomes self-fulfilling and dependents.

>> if i hear you correctly, star of these people. you just said to me, it seems out of whack that one out of three people in this country. >> that does not sound right to me. neil: you just said you think it's something about this economy. i'm telling you the regardless of the economy depression level error type numbers. >> if it's true you're saying 100 million people only get their food through food stamps. neil: 15,000,009 getting some sort of food assistance from the government. that's what i'm saying. >> that is a lot. i take issue with the idea that everyone who is getting food assistance is not out working. neil: i am not saying they are all bombs, but those who truly need it versus those who are just getting it, there is a huge chasm.

>> i was supportive of the area of having a work requirement, in the 90's because i do think you know what set the race environment reseeded parents going to work. the air with that completely. >> either way, i have many mothers with children that come and work one shift, many. not eight, not ten, almost 4,000 people. and maybe 1,000 of them have children come to work. we have a brother works and our corporate offices that has two children. she barton's on the weekends. she works in our office as a paralegal and chia's to school at night. neil: we have to rethink it. thank you both in the meantime. something else that continues to be out of control. folks paying taxes. but it is. >> everybody else including rich people are willing to pay more. they want to pay more.

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>> the only people who feel there should not be more coming into the government are republicans in congress even the rich people are willing to pay more and they want to pay more. neil: and i tell washington every day take more many. take the money. david stockman her that and is here with me now. >> that is more banter from

harry reid which we come to expect there will be higher taxes this is a pathetic fiasco with the shutdown shutdown, the debt ceiling when the republicans snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. they dug-in they got it sold the other river by mcconnell and some republicans. neil: but now would you break the debt ceiling? >> the debt ceiling would never be breached. they were days for improving this is a myth that there is an armageddon on the other side of october 17 and forced the president to prioritize. we said he could pay the interest and then you have a fair fight. neil: now it is lost no harry reid says there is a

reason to cut spending which mimics what nancy pelosi said. i don't advocate that but it i made a mistake when i negotiated for those revenue increases it is off the table these people our weak and divided maybe the tea party will begin but then they will be sold down the river by a surrender artist but they say they don't want to cut back nobody wants to pay more taxes. we have to reform the entitlements to stop the

automatic spending machine that is 2.4 trillion of automatic entitlements of missouri spending. so if they don't use the debt ceiling as a lever to force real spending reform the national that will keep rising then sooner or later someone will have to pay taxes. >> it is not just all blamed on the rich so wateree realistically looking at? >> we're looking at hundreds of millions of higher taxes in the years ahead for the middle-class. neil: right now is around 40 percent. >> data think we should raise the income-tax but that said we need a consumption tax and we need to lower the payroll taxes that is killing jobs. neil: i can see the consumption tax but it is

still added to the income-tax. >> but until the republicans get out there to start talking honestly. neil: they are not. they are riding around in circles civic talking about spending cuts. be enough of that already the cold war ended 25 years ago. neil: so your discussion is we're open to scaling back defense dick then democrats did not respond with entitlements. >> they don't. republicans defend the pentagon democrats defend the social security nobility defends the taxpayer who will carry the debt the economy sinks more under this bird in hand we hear in the nonfunctional dysfunctional broken system that you cannot overemphasize to overemphasize the situation

to cut it on top of that bet we have the fed out of control by many printers with the fiscal mess the federal reserve out of control if you have a very bad scenario not to be pessimistic but to raise spieler we have real problems of this country. neil: amazing. david stockton in the meantime imagine you hold a press conference saying everything is fine and dandy dandy live on one of the houses that the press conference goes on and on its you hear what is said. this is what happens. >> we pay a mortgage doghouse we cannot live in a and taxes on the house economic dividend paying insurance that will pay us for the damage to the houses neil: she is here. what's better than zero heartburn?

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>> i have went everywhere and everybody is confusing. nobody has got to help. neil: make this woman a senator dow. she years said the york attorney general talking about progress made since sandy on her friends block she said that is not the case. she is 86 and right to the attorney-general space. i will not ask her what needs -- a nasty question because she scares me. good for you. good to have you how did this come about? talk about one year later with the progress how much they had made? >> i had no idea it was going on. my house was damaged by sandy we cannot go back and it has been one year. the before the storm left to -- gave we left there we

have not been back since. but we still get the mail the road is blocked off the cold -- the cops did come back in one hour i appear to get my mail. i walked past a conference i start to listen to what they say and the politicians were strategically placed in front of my neighbor's house that was obviously damaged and falling apart they kept saying the charitable contributions to help people like this and people like this. i could not take it anymore it has been one ar. as it dwindled down i said it is not right. i have to say something. neil: what did you say? you know, better than anybody of the real story. >> i said the same line at from every avenue i have pursued we will look into a. call my office. i called each office. i had.

did you apply? really? i have been homeless for the past year. i did that in april. neil: what did they say? >> we cannot help you if you don't come to us there are organizations to help you. >> i said tell me the name of them. neil: all of these say look what we have done but we have accomplished that you say life is not great. >> absolutely not for a few are middle-class with the mortgage and you pay it and full taxes and insurance life is not happy. >> you pay more gave john a house that is lucky to be there so that is weird. >> it is bathetic and unsafe neil: what have you been told since? did agree were told don't worry fema will be but i have insurance claims pending because that comes first. neil: so fema does nothing?

>> every program that i have come across the idea sounds good and mbb the intentions are good but the way it is a disturbing is a nightmare. neil: how would you do it differently? >> i would help the people that are hurt. that is what we need. neil: what do you need? >> i need rental assistance i cannot continue paying a mortgage and paying rent. fema to cut me off in february because apparently i am rich. i did not know that. neil: so all of these we have countless others they have not seen anything? where does that money go? >> absolutely we ask that every day. the public perception is of course, you get help. there raised so much money it did not go to individuals and organizations who have programs and in and of those

programs benefited me. the salvation army will give free furniture that's great title have a house. i will give you a mattress. i don't have a house. neil: where are yo >> with the parents and my old bedroom. neil: thank you very much. >> king in their. it sounds like empty rhetoric but this is incredible. this is a lesson for future politicians that if you have a press conference lauding what a great job your doing you better not be on her street. we will have more including the british media who said said something so goofy it makes me think he should be removed from the planet. >> that egalitarian system massive redistribution of wealth and massive responsibility it is a filthy word because wherever there is a profit there is there is a profit there is also a deficit. this is the quicksilver cash back card from capital one.

it's not the "juggle a bunch of rotating categories" card. it's not the "sign up for rewards each quarter" card. it's the no-games, no-messing-'round, no-earning-limit-having, do-i-look-like-i'm-joking, turbo-boosting, heavyweight-champion- of-the-world cash back card. this is the quicksilver cash back card from capital one. unlimited 1.5% cash back on every purchase, everywhere, every damn day. now, tell me, what's in your wallet? ...amelia... neil and buzz: for teaching us that you can't create the future... by clinging to the past. and with that: you're history. instead of looking behind... delta is looking beyond. 80 thousand of us investing billions... in everything from the best experiences below... to the finest comforts above. we're not simply saluting history... we're making it.

senate this socialist egalitarian system heavy taxation of corporations and massive responsibility for an energy company to exploit the environment said very concept of profit could be reduced to evade cameron said it is not a dirty word i say it is healthy because there is also deficit wherever there is profit. neil: and i say he is a complete fool. he has $50 million in people laughing about his comment but then the city to him maybe they should have no problem giving away 99.9% of his money away. is mcdonald's is outraged.

>> it was amazing. if that was the case then nobody could pay for his performances i was watching it was a comedy routine but in the same interview he said yes i had addiction to drugs but was based on the social convictions of where he grew up. neil: is attending the success he is paid through companies if they don't make money they give away all their profits, then he doesn't get the beautiful women to head off of his shoulder. >> who could afford comedy routines? even with his wealth? by the way if you tax all of his wealth i don't thank you could even pay for half the month spending of the york city. spending profits are

deficits? i don't get that. but the trade of thought was making those local stops. neil: i worry about those that are impressionable that like him as understand the comedy bit but they take it seriously. >> they do but have you heard from occupy wall street lately? where are they? he could be the new head. yes we do have these outburst there is a learning curve always but they knew here tied it again from actors you have to scratch your head to say what is the thought process. neil: i don't go. thank you very much liz macdonald in just a reminder you indeed nothing if you you indeed nothing if you were not customer erin swenson ordered shoes from us online but they didn't fit.

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neil: in southwest hits now the company that avoided the fees will now start it is a defining moment. is a risky move? melissa that? >> it is a huge mistake i think. bags fly free that it is almost there tagline in you wanted to fly cheap that is when you get on the southwest. neil: maybe they cannot afford that. >> but this ceo thinks they would get $1 billion of customers from other airlines now he has tens of millions of baggage these? it looked at the mouth. >> it is a great move they let everyone else takes the hits now they had people accused of that now they come in to say we will start charging baggage fees i used to that.

neil: i don't know. >> charge for something else or double for the soda because that is your tagline bags fly free. neil: he doesn't even know what commercial travel is. [laughter] at. >> i am impressed. neil: twitter estimates 10 billion and it went hundred 40 characters or less as a worth that? remain there killing on revenue but losing money and worse of all people are starting to look at twitter a little less. >> they doubled revenue they doubled losses. how do you do that? a lot of people use the idea of how they monetize that i don't think it is worth the price but they have great algorithms to soar to a people say and sell that information the whole internet is creepy. have you been there?

that is the seat of the internet. ♪ neil: what is that? it is time for a the nightcap. >> apple earnings coming down next week also with i those sales losing out to samsung they have these all slot cards they have a lot of cool stuff. >> i will be looking at the continued breakup of obamacare. i hope it continues. maybe it is a repudiation of all liberal big government policies. i hope it gives everything and many related a boost. neil: it would break away. >> i don't think so. if you create the entitlement it is here to stay forever and ever and ever. neil: and ever and ever.

think you very much. we will monitor the us more issues for the health care law next week. serious concerns that key parts not only to be delayed it's pretty clear that the republican party is not unified. different factions want to take the party in different directions. there's the old guard and the new turks. we're talking with governor mike huckabee about whether the republicans can get it together in order to win next year's elections, right here, right now. >> it's "tom sullivan show." here's your host, tom sullivan. >> thank you for joining us. if you follow the headlines you would think republicans across the country fighting, but you know upon closer inspections it seems to be more center in the washington. and congress, senators and representatives in the house are